[TriEmbed] Logic Analyzer Recommendatio (Christopher Svec)
Charles McClelland
chip at mcclellands.org
Mon Jan 19 16:11:55 CST 2015
Chris,
I would certainly be interested in a demo. The idea of moving beyond Serial.println(“debug info here”) is huge and I am excited to see how best to use these tools from folks like yourself who have experience. Given the relatively low price, I would think this topic would have broad appeal to the group.
I think I will get a Saleae Logic device but am torn between the Logic 4 and 8 and - of course - neither are currently available.
Thanks,
Chip
> On Jan 19, 2015, at 5:00 PM, triembed-request at triembed.org wrote:
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> 1. Re: Logic Analyzer Recommendatio
> (=?utf-8?B?cGV0ZUBzb3Blci51cw==?=)
> 2. Re: Logic Analyzer Recommendatio (Christopher Svec)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2015 16:47:13 -0500
> From: "=?utf-8?B?cGV0ZUBzb3Blci51cw==?=" <pete at soper.us>
> To: "=?utf-8?B?R2xlbiBTbWl0aA==?=" <mrglenasmith at gmail.com>,
> "=?utf-8?B?VHJpRW1iZWQgRGlzY3Vzc2lvbg==?=" <triembed at triembed.org>
> Subject: Re: [TriEmbed] Logic Analyzer Recommendatio
> Message-ID:
> <mailman.34.1421704813.65422.triembed_triembed.org at triembed.org>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> When they say the older bp has the same major features they leave out "and unlike with the new rev the features are all in the firmware as well as the marketing literature". Seriously, this is one of those rare cases where the implicit vs explicit contracts of open source sometimes fall short. If you want the new bp i'm sure Splatspace will make a deal. :-)
>
> ----- Reply message -----
> From: "Glen Smith" <mrglenasmith at gmail.com>
> To: "TriEmbed Discussion" <triembed at triembed.org>
> Subject: [TriEmbed] Logic Analyzer Recommendatio
> Date: Mon, Jan 19, 2015 3:53 PM
>
> I don't have any personal experience to add, but with all the talk I went looking for info on the Bus Pirate 3 & 4.
>
> From the Seed Studio web site:
> "Seeed Studio
> is the official manufacturer and supporter of the Bus Pirate project.
> Version 4 is the next generation Bus Pirate hardware, but it's not as
> stable as Bus Pirate v3.
> If you're just starting out with the Bus Pirate we still recommend v3 -
> it's cheaper, more reliable, and has all the same major features. See a
> Bus Pirate v4 vs v3 comparison. Protocols
> 1-Wire, I2C, SPI, JTAG, asynchronous serial (UART), MIDI, PC keyboard,
> HD44780 LCDs, and generic 2- and 3-wire libraries for custom protocols."
>
> It sounds like if you want to get some work done using the thing, V3 is the way to go, if you want another project, V4 apparently needs help getting firmed up.
>
> Glen
>
>
>
> On Mon, Jan 19, 2015 at 3:41 PM, Jon Wolfe <jonjwolfe at anibit.com> wrote:
> I should have mentioned that about the bus pirate.? The 3.x version has been the recommended version for a long time. It seems like as Pete said, that the 4.x has been in beta forever. I have never used a 4.x but I've almost bought one just for comparison several times.
> I also have the open logic sniffer, ?and I still give an edge the the sallae logic in the usability, especially in client tools. The ols is technically faster and has more data lines, but at high speeds the on board buffer fills in no time. There is a differential/rle mode I think, but it was wonky for me when I tried. If your smaple rate is low enough, ?the sallea streams over usb so you essentially have an unlimited buffer.? I don't think the ols can do that. The ols does have more sophisticated triggers iirc though.
>
> Ther short answer Chip, is that you should just go out amd buy yourself one of each ;)
>
> --Jon
>
>
>
>
>
> -------- Original message --------
> From: Pete Soper
> Date:01/19/2015 3:27 PM (GMT-05:00)
> To: triembed at triembed.org
> Subject: Re: [TriEmbed] Logic Analyzer Recommendatio
>
>
> Sorry to be late to the party.
>
>
>
> Two things with the bus pirate:
>
> ??? 1) Be super-careful to avoid the "latest" hardware version if
> the software for that never got completed. I don't know if this
> situation was ever corrected, but the last time I checked after (the
> worthless) Bus Pirate for Splatspace wasn't cooperating the firmware
> author appeared to have publicly backed away from completing the
> work (but that was at least 18 months ago).
>
> ?? 2) The Bus Pirate is so slow and that even it's maker warns
> against considering it equivalent to a logic analyzer for high speed
> data.
>
>
>
> I've been using the Dangerous Prototypes "Open Bench Logic Sniffer"
> for a long time and it's gotten the job done. It isn't particularly
> fast (200msps as I recall) but that's been fast enough for every
> situation I've been in, and should certainly be adequate for SPI.
>
> The problematic aspect with this hardware is that even the best
> client software (OLS) is a
> bit brittle with respect to the USB interface, occasionally
> requiring a restart.
>
>
>
> -Pete
>
>
>
> On 01/18/2015 11:54 AM, Chip McClelland
> wrote:
>
>
>
> To?all, ?thanks for the responses thus far. I have one
> other question before I pull the trigger on this.? Does the Saleae
> doe enough extra to justify the extra price over the Bus Pirate? ?
> My main focus today is listening to the I2C bus but am open to
> getting a more capable tool if it may be helpful in the future.
>
>
>
>
> Thanks, ?
>
> Chip?
>
>
>
> O
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
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>
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> ------------------------------
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> Message: 2
> Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2015 16:59:25 -0500
> From: Christopher Svec <christophersvec at gmail.com>
> To: "pete at soper.us" <pete at soper.us>
> Cc: TriEmbed Discussion <triembed at triembed.org>
> Subject: Re: [TriEmbed] Logic Analyzer Recommendatio
> Message-ID:
> <CADdJ5eUou8ZWVHFqTwCri9DEf5Bc_5b2aD1s2=LdJzM+atxPzQ at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> I've been using Saleae's original products for a few years now and have
> been relatively happy with them. Though you can't buy them anymore,
> hopefully the newer products are also good.
>
> Their "Logic" was an 8 channel logic analyzer, and "Logic 16" was the
> 16-channel version. No analog support on either, just digital inputs. Their
> software is cross platform (I've used it on Mac, Linux, and Windows); it's
> pretty good, thought of course it has a few bugs.
>
> I'm happy to bring & demo them to the next triembed meetup if anyone is
> interested.
>
> -svec
>
> On Mon, Jan 19, 2015 at 4:47 PM, pete at soper.us <pete at soper.us> wrote:
>
>> When they say the older bp has the same major features they leave out "and
>> unlike with the new rev the features are all in the firmware as well as the
>> marketing literature". Seriously, this is one of those rare cases where the
>> implicit vs explicit contracts of open source sometimes fall short. If you
>> want the new bp i'm sure Splatspace will make a deal. :-)
>> ----- Reply message -----
>> From: "Glen Smith" <mrglenasmith at gmail.com>
>> To: "TriEmbed Discussion" <triembed at triembed.org>
>> Subject: [TriEmbed] Logic Analyzer Recommendatio
>> Date: Mon, Jan 19, 2015 3:53 PM
>>
>> I don't have any personal experience to add, but with all the talk I went
>> looking for info on the Bus Pirate 3 & 4.
>>
>> From the Seed Studio web site:
>> "Seeed Studio is the official manufacturer and supporter of the Bus Pirate
>> project. Version 4 is the next generation Bus Pirate hardware, but it's not
>> as stable as Bus Pirate v3
>> <http://www.seeedstudio.com/depot/bus-pirate-v3-assembled-p-609.html?cPath=174>.
>> If you're just starting out with the Bus Pirate we still recommend v3 -
>> it's cheaper, more reliable, and has all the same major features. See a Bus
>> Pirate v4 vs v3 comparison
>> <http://dangerousprototypes.com/docs/Bus_Pirate_v4_vs_v3_comparison>.
>> *Protocols* 1-Wire, I2C, SPI, JTAG, asynchronous serial (UART), MIDI, PC
>> keyboard, HD44780 LCDs, and generic 2- and 3-wire libraries for custom
>> protocols."
>>
>> It sounds like if you want to get some work done using the thing, V3 is
>> the way to go, if you want another project, V4 apparently needs help
>> getting firmed up.
>>
>> Glen
>>
>>
>> On Mon, Jan 19, 2015 at 3:41 PM, Jon Wolfe <jonjwolfe at anibit.com> wrote:
>>
>>> I should have mentioned that about the bus pirate. The 3.x version has
>>> been the recommended version for a long time. It seems like as Pete said,
>>> that the 4.x has been in beta forever. I have never used a 4.x but I've
>>> almost bought one just for comparison several times.
>>>
>>> I also have the open logic sniffer, and I still give an edge the the
>>> sallae logic in the usability, especially in client tools. The ols is
>>> technically faster and has more data lines, but at high speeds the on board
>>> buffer fills in no time. There is a differential/rle mode I think, but it
>>> was wonky for me when I tried. If your smaple rate is low enough, the
>>> sallea streams over usb so you essentially have an unlimited buffer. I
>>> don't think the ols can do that. The ols does have more sophisticated
>>> triggers iirc though.
>>>
>>> Ther short answer Chip, is that you should just go out amd buy yourself
>>> one of each ;)
>>>
>>> --Jon
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> -------- Original message --------
>>> From: Pete Soper
>>> Date:01/19/2015 3:27 PM (GMT-05:00)
>>> To: triembed at triembed.org
>>> Subject: Re: [TriEmbed] Logic Analyzer Recommendatio
>>>
>>> Sorry to be late to the party.
>>>
>>> Two things with the bus pirate:
>>> 1) Be super-careful to avoid the "latest" hardware version if the
>>> software for that never got completed. I don't know if this situation was
>>> ever corrected, but the last time I checked after (the worthless) Bus
>>> Pirate for Splatspace wasn't cooperating the firmware author appeared to
>>> have publicly backed away from completing the work (but that was at least
>>> 18 months ago).
>>> 2) The Bus Pirate is so slow and that even it's maker warns against
>>> considering it equivalent to a logic analyzer for high speed data.
>>>
>>> I've been using the Dangerous Prototypes "Open Bench Logic Sniffer" for a
>>> long time and it's gotten the job done. It isn't particularly fast (200msps
>>> as I recall) but that's been fast enough for every situation I've been in,
>>> and should certainly be adequate for SPI.
>>> The problematic aspect with this hardware is that even the best client
>>> software (OLS <http://www.lxtreme.nl/ols/>) is a bit brittle with
>>> respect to the USB interface, occasionally requiring a restart.
>>>
>>> -Pete
>>>
>>> On 01/18/2015 11:54 AM, Chip McClelland wrote:
>>>
>>> To all, thanks for the responses thus far. I have one other question
>>> before I pull the trigger on this. Does the Saleae doe enough extra to
>>> justify the extra price over the Bus Pirate? My main focus today is
>>> listening to the I2C bus but am open to getting a more capable tool if it
>>> may be helpful in the future.
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>> Chip
>>>
>>> O
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Triangle, NC Embedded Computing mailing list
>>> TriEmbed at triembed.org
>>> http://mail.triembed.org/mailman/listinfo/triembed_triembed.org
>>> TriEmbed web site: http://TriEmbed.org
>>>
>>>
>>
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>> TriEmbed web site: http://TriEmbed.org
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